Recipes EGoo

EGoo 1.0 [April 2012 recipe. UPDATED march 2013]

Egoo with a small tri-wand.

Jakey and the Giant Bubbles

An early test using a bit more WSR301 than the current recipe. Watch full-size at HD resolution.

2012 04 28 rayon modular 4 1 blue, egoo

An Egoo test session. Watch full-size at HD resolution.

2012 04 28 modular 32" rayon loop 4 1 white

Another Egoo test run

Once you get the amount of PEO figured out, this recipe makes a bubble juice that is great for very colorful giant bubbles. It also works well with garland wands.

March 2013 Note

Before brewing this recipe, take some time to read the whole page. At the time that this page was first published (April 2012), this was my preferred bubble juice and many afficionados around the world had great results with it. Since the recipe was first published, it has become clear that the potency of PEO (both WSR301 and J-Lube) can vary quite a bit depending on how it was stored and possibly other factors -- including the storage conditions at the merchants! It is possible that a just-bought batch of PEO can be degraded. The recipe as it appears on this page was based on PEO that turns out to have about 1/4-1/3 the potency of fully-potent PEO. You will need to spend a little time figuring out how much PEO you need to use. I have included the information in the article for helping determine the amount of PEO that you need. I have also been finding that fresh-mixed juice with this recipe tends to outperform the concentrate. I believe that this is because the baking soda/citric acid/water reaction is most beneficial when in the presence of the dilution water and soap.

Original intrododuction. April 2012

This is the recipe for a super-concentrated bubble goo that is especially nice for making bubble juice that has water to detergent ratios in the range of 20:1 to 35:1. At the upper range of dilution (where detergent to water is over 35:1), you may find it useful to supplement with a bit more PEO or BLM.

1/4 cup of EGoo can be diluted with anywhere from 3 to 5 1/2 cups water (or more). When using the maximum dilution, you may want to supplement with some additional PEO or BLM as high dilutions need significantly more PEO than less dilute solutions for optimal friendliness. When using only 3 cups of water, the result is quite, well, gooey. When using more water, it won't seem stringy at all.

 Important Note About This Recipe

(Updated March 2013). This recipe was developed using some WSR301 and J-Lube that apparently had lost some potency. I am exploring a way to make the recipe more universal. All PEO-based recipes have this problem. PEO can change dramatically in storage (more about this below).

If you have full-potency PEO, you might need 1/4-1/3 the amount of PEO called for in the recipe. If your PEO has degraded, you might need even more than called for. The only way to figure out the amount is to mix some up and see if it requires adjustment by following the directions provided. There are many video links below to give you an idea of how this juice will perform when correctly tuned. Once you have it "tuned", the recipe will be stable as long as you store your PEO so that it does not degrade. Storing it in the freezer seems to be the best way to guarantee stability.

I recommend that you figure out the correct amount of PEO by following the directions in the Fresh Mix section below. When you get a fresh mix working well, you will know the amount to use for making the concentrate.

Follow this page to be notified of updates.

See also: this blog entry about PEO potency.

Recipe

READ CAREFULLY! As noted elsewhere on this page, you will have to experiment a bit to find the correct amount of PEO to use since potency of PEO can vary (due to storage conditions both before and after the PEO was purchased). We have found that some WSR301 and J-Lube are so potent that you can use 1/4 the amount called for in the recipe. Some has lost enough potency that you might need twice as much as called for. Read the Fresh Mix section for details about figuring out the right amount to use.

8 oz of EGoo makes 1 gallon of bubble juice when diluting with 15 parts water. (I currently favor 20 parts water per 1 part concentrate - July 2012).

The following recipe makes 8 oz (roughly 1/4 liter) of EGoo. The recipe scales up well by doubling, tripling or quadrupling all of the ingredients.

My recommended dilution range is 16 to 22 parts water per 1 part concentrate. If you do not have a scale that is precise to hundedths of a gram, you should make no less than a quadruple batch if you are using WSR301 since scales that measure tenths of grams are not accurate enough to measure 0.56 grams.

Make sure to read the notes lower down on this page!

Ingredients

0.56* grams PolyOx WSR301 or 2.24* grams J-Lube [See potency note below.  You may need to use much less OR a bit more!]
3.2 grams baking soda
1.6 grams citric acid

76 grams room temperature or warm (not hot) water

146 grams Dawn Pro

PEO Note: Dow PolyOx WSR301 and J-Lube are two sources of PEO of similar molecular weight. More J-Lube is required than WSR301 because J-Lube is only 25% PEO. The PEO in J-Lube and WSR301 is of a similar weight -- although some tests indicate that J-Lube has a slightly higher molecular weight. For more information see the Ingredients article.

* PEO Potency Note. PLEASE READ. The amount of PEO specified (WSR301 or J-Lube) was based on the WSR301 and J-Lube that I had at the time that the recipe was developed (Jan.-Apr. 2012). It is now (August 2012) clear that the PEO I was working with were not at full-potency. High molecular weight PEO becomes less potent (but more friendly) over time. If you have PEO that is close to full-potency or has only started to lose potency, you must use less PEO than specified. If you have fully-potent PEO, use 1/4 to 1/3 the amount specified. Unless you have an insanely accurate scale, you would do this by tripling or quadrupling the quantities of the other ingredients. See the Fresh Mix section below for details about figuring out the right amount of PEO to use.

Adjusting the PEO amount. When properly adjusted, eGoo bubble juice diluted with at 16:1 (water:concentrate) should be very slightly stringy. If you dip a small plastic bubble wand in it and raise it, the juice will flow off but there will be a tiny thread of juice as the juice flows off of it. If the juice comes off as discrete drops with no 'thread' then you should increase the amount of PEO. If the juice is very stringy, you should reduce the amount of PEO. I estimate that you can use just about 1/4 the amount of PEO as called for above if you have full-potency PEO. Note that the potency is based largely on the age of the PEO. It is possible to have just-purchased PEO that is not at full-potency due to potency loss on the merchant/distributor's shelf. I am working on a better method of determining the amount of PEO that you should use.

Stringiness demonstration. Watch this video in HD to get an idea of what the diluted juice's 'stringiness' level should be. The "just right" amount is in the right ballpark but a bit more stringy is ok, too. If you have fresh, fully-potent PEO, you may want something a little bit stringier than what is shown. Please leave a comment if this video was helpful to you.

DETERGENT NOTE: When I use Gain, the results are ok but nowhere near as good as with Dawn Pro. It may be an issue of dilution. The goo made with Gain is much more self-siphoning than when made with Dawn Pro. It may be that a higher dilution will yield better results or a different amount of Gain (either less or more -- I am not yet sure). I have had mixed reports of good results with Fairy Ultra. A couple of people report excellent results and one reliable person reported disappointing results. We are trying to determine if this is a PEO "strength" issue.

Steps

Fizz mix the PEO. Combine powders in a narrow-bottomed tall container (if available). It needs to be tall-enough to contain the foam that will be created when the fizzing starts. Start stirring the powders before you start to pour the water. While stirring the powder, add the water and continue stirring until the foam has subsided and you have a nice uniform mix (this can take 30 seconds to a couple of minutes). NOTE: You do not need to use fizz mixing. If you have another preferred method of mixing up PEO, feel free to use your preferred method.

Add the Dawn Pro after the fizzing and foam have subsided. Stir gently to mix the detergent and goo. You want a uniform mix.

It is best to let the goo sit for 10 to 15 minutes before using although it can be diluted right away for use.

This concentrate seems to have a very nice shelf-life at a reasonable room temperature.

Fresh Mix

Making a full-diluted mix rather than the eGoo concentrate is a good idea when determining how much PEO you need to use. I recommend mixing up a fresh mix and determing what adjustments need to be made to the PEO amount before mixing up concentrates. To do this, mix up the eGoo and then dilute with water at a ratio of 16:1 water-to-concentrate.

IF THE FRESH MIX IS STRINGY

If the mix is very stringy after diluting, put one half-liter of the diluted eGoo into a container.

Mix up a water/detergent/baking soda/citric acid solution (1000 grams water,1 gram baking soda, 40 grams detergent, 0.5 grams citric acid in that order).

Add a quarter liter of the water/detergent mix to the diluted eGoo and test to see if the juice is still stringy.

Keep track of how much water/detergent mix you needed to add before the juice became barely stringy.

Test with a small plastic wand and blow gently and continuously to see how many bubbles you can get from a dip. You should be able to get about 10 bubbles or more. (At least 5 on the vast majority of dips.)

If after adding 1 liter of the water/detergent mix, the juice is still very stringy. Mix up another liter fo the water/detergent mix and continue diluting the juice. How to figure out how to adjust the amount of PEO. Use the amount of water/detergent that you needed to use to determine how much less PEO to use when mixing up eGoo. For instance, if you needed to add 1 liter to the 1/2 liter of juice (a 2:1 ratio) then for future batches use 1/3 the amount of PEO as called for in the recipe. If you needed to add 1/2 liter (a 1:1 ratio), use 1/2 the amount of PEO.

IF THE FRESH MIX IS NOT STRINGY AT ALL

If the fresh mix is not stringy at all, you will need to use more PEO the next time. In your next mix, use 1/4 again as much as called for in the recipe. (For example, use 2.7 grams of J-Lube instead of 2.24 grams. If that mix is not stringy then use even more next time. If it is not string at 2.24 grams but is stringy at 2.7, try using the juice and see how it works. You can try adding a bit more water. This basic recipe -- when the PEO is adjusted correctly -- can work well even with water:detergent ratios of 30:1-35:1!)

Dilution

Dilution recommendation: While eGoo works with a variety of dilutions, I recommend trying 16-22 parts water to 1 part concentrate before trying other dilutions.

Dilution Table

The table below shows information about diluted eGoo at various water:concentrate ratios. It includes a column that will be especially convenient to people that like to dilute using measuring cups. When diluting by volume try to be as accurate as possible. Tablespoons are an American measure that is equivalent to 0.5 fluid ounces.

eGoo Dilution Table*

Water:Conc. Ratio	Resulting Water:Det. Ratio	Water to Add to 1/4 cup eGoo	PEO%	Notes
12.5:1	20:1	3 cups + 2 tbsp	0.0192%
15:1	23.8:1	3-3/4 cups	0.016%
16.4:1	25:1	4 cups + 2 tbsp	0.015%
19:1	30:1	4-3/4 cups	0.0128%
20:1	31.7:1	5 cups	0.012%
22:1	35:1	5-1/2 cups	0.011%

% PEO is calculated as a function of total water rather than as a function of the total bubble juice

QUICK TIP! MAKING A GALLON OF JUICE. To make one gallon of diluted juice with an approximate water:detergent ratio of 16.5:1 use 217 grams of eGoo concentrate and 3574 grams water.

• The PEO dilution is based on 0.56 grams of WSR301 or 2.24 grams of J-Lube per 'batch'. This table will need to be re-adjusted when the recipe is updated to take into account the PEO potency. [August 2012]

Important Application Notes

I have received a lot of feedback recently with people both loving eGoo and being frustrated by it. I am investigating to get to the bottom of the inconsistency. There are a few factors that may be coming in to play.

One thing has become clear, mixing the super-concentrate and then diluting yields different results from doing a fresh mix with the same quantities of the ingredients and skipping the super-concentrate phase. If you have disappointing results when using eGoo, try mixing up a batch that uses the same quantities of ingredients as a diluted mix, use about twice as much baking soda/citric acid as called for, and add the detergent last.

Preliminary results (and guessing) seem to indicate that (especially if the eGoo has been resting for a long time) using very warm water to dilute is useful. Make sure to stir quite thoroughly after diluting. The mix may improve over night (especially if the goo has been resting a long time). It seems that this super-concentrate MAY (this could be wrong) need a bit longer than less-concentrated mixes to reach its optimal state. (Is it possible that the very long molecular chains actually need time to untangle?)

• WSR301/J-Lube "Quality" - see the note below.
• Baking soda/citric acid amount - some people are finding that the mix improves with more baking soda and citric acid. You can use twice as much (or more) as is called for in the recipe without risk it appears. If you dilute and the performance is disappointing, add more baking soda/citric acid OR 1/2 tsp. baking powder per liter of bubble juice. Stir and let it sit for 15 minutes or so and then stir gently again. If using baking powder, there will be some white sediment. Don't worry about it.
• Hydration time - I have done a few tests with a 3 month old batch of eGoo and the juice performed better the day after dilution than it did 10 minutes after dilution.
• Dilution procedure - it seems to help to use very warm water to do the diluting.

PEO "POTENCY" (August 12, 2012). Based on feedback from a fairly sizable number of people , some of whom are loving eGoo and some of whom are getting disappointing results, it appears that eGoo may be more sensitive than some other recipes to the amount of PEO (WSR301 or J-Lube) or some other factors that may include water content. It is looking quite likely that the variations in performance are related to the state of the PEO. WSR301 and J-Lube (and all very high molecular weight PEO) have a tendency to "degrade" into a lower molecular weight over time. Even the "degraded" stuff works great. And, in fact, once degraded it is extremely stable. It is very difficult to tell (except in extreme cases) where one is at on the aging curve. If you are using Dawn Pro and this recipe (mixed as directed) is disappointing, it probably means that you need to use either less PEO or more. People with very fresh PEO are reporting that mixed as recommended and diluted at 16 parts water and one part concentrate that they are getting a solution that is very very stringy. If this is the case, you should use 1/4-1/2 the amount of PEO. If the mix doesn't work well and the solution is not stringy at all -- you may need to use up to twice the amount of PEO recommended. I am trying to figure out a simple test to determine PEO equivalence -- but I have not had a chance to delve deeply. IF YOUR DILUTED JUICE IS STRINGY: dilute the juice with a mix of 25 parts water, 1 part detergent and 2 grams baking soda/1 gram citric acid (per liter water) until the performance improves. Depending on the potency of your PEO, you might need as much as 3 or 4 parts of the water/detergent solution for each part of diluted eGoo.

One thing has become pretty clear, mixing as directed gives different results than if you make a mix that has all the same total amounts as this recipe but is mixed by creating a fully diluted solution.

Videos

A couple of long-lasting pretty big bubbles, one of which is attacked by a large crow. Water:concentrate ratio: 20:1 (>30:1 water:detergent ratio). Conditions pretty good with 65% humidity. Full-sun. 63F. 2012 07 20 test session.

Windy unfavorable conditions. 20:1 water:concentrate ratio, strong winds, 50% humidity and 70F. 2012 07 21 evening test session. This large bubble doesn't last long due to the very strong wind. But the color is great. The smaller bubbles that broke off -- however -- lasted a long time.

A long session with eGoo. This is a 13 minute video of a complete session with no dips edited out to give you a feel for how well-behaving eGoo should perform under nice conditions.

Long tubes (2012 08 30) . I spent a few minutes making tubes with a 32" topstring loop. The loop was Lehigh SecureLine diamond braid cord which has pretty good capacity (but nowhere near the capacity of the Rubbermaid mop yarns). Conditions were 66F and 62% humidity with only a slight breeze. The tubes would have been longer with a somewhat stronger breeze. This should give you an idea of what eGoo can do. The dilution was 17:1 water:concentrate (a bit more than 25:1 water:detergent).

Long closed tube (2012 08 31) . The video is just one dip of a 72-inch topstring loop. The top-string is full-ply rayon mop yarn. The bottom string is just 2-strands of the rayon mop yarn. This is a modular loop (top and bottom just clipped onto the leads). The closed tube is at least 36 feet long. (The lines in the street are 10 feet apart and the street width is 21 feet from middle-of-gutter to middle-of-gutter). The water:concentrate ratio was 17:1. Temp: 58F. Humidity: 82%

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